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Josh Luub
United States
San Jose
California
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Hey, looking for suggestions for PC-based wargames, preferably hex-and-counter, but other turn-based systems would be ok (no real-time).
I've tried Korsun Pocket, and it's good, but it seems like they figured that since the computer could handle all the bookkeeping, they'd throw in as much bookkeeping as possible -- making it very difficult to figure out what is going on, or how a given attack will come out, or if your units will be in supply, etc.
So, looking for something less complicated than Korsun Pocket, hopefully with a computer opponent (although I suppose a healthy on-line community would be ok), with decent art/graphics (Korsun Pocket is looking a bit old in this regard). Preferably based on an existing physical wargame, but not necessarily. Matrix Games seems to have a pretty good portfolio of wargames, do any of them fit this criteria?
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Josh Luub
United States
San Jose
California
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bleakgeek wrote: Panzer General!
Ooh... there's even a demo, getting it now...
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Simon Hilsdorf
Germany
Mannheim
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bleakgeek wrote: Panzer General!
Check out this link: http://lgames.sourceforge.net/index.php?project=LGeneral
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Alex Henderson
Cayman Islands
Grand Cayman
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"Best" is a tough one. Here are some of the best, but they are not typical "hex & counter" games. The market has moved away from those, to a fair extent.
The Combat Mission series - WW2 tactical; enter your orders, then watch the turn (60 seconds) resolved in real-time
Crown of Glory / Forge of Freedom - strategic-level games on the Wars of Napoleon / US Civil War; area movement, resources, bookeeping
Birth of America - The French & Indian war on a strategic level; area movement
Flight Commander II - a unique game on the tactics of air operations; not a flight sim; has the best-looking manual ever!
There are many more.
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Josh Luub
United States
San Jose
California
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LGeneral looks interesting, I'll check that out.
I tried Combat Mission, didn't like it. Why do I have to wait 60 seconds to see the outcome of my move? Rolling on a CRT takes 1 second.
I'll look at the other ones, thanks.
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Seppo Kuukasjärvi
Finland
Jyväskylä
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Panzer General II!
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Mitch Willis
United States
Kathleen
Georgia
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The two best computer wargames I ever played that were both hex-and-counter and turn-based were two old SSI titles: Landry and Kriegel's Battles of Napoleon and Norm Koger's Age of Rifles. Spent numerous hours trying to both alter and repeat history with those two titles. There were literally hundreds of scenarios that were available as well. Alas, they were both DOS programs and don't run real well on today's ultra-fast PCs...I have one PC 'retrofitted' with Windows 98 just so I can play them every now and then...wish some one would pick these titles up and give them a proper upgrade, but I doubt it'll ever happen...
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Brad Miller
United States
Seattle
Washington
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Combat Mission by far.
It was going to be computer Squad Leader, til the designer had a falling out of some sort with AH. It is really, really good, though tactical, not strategic.
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Ookami Snow
United States
Kansas
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Well according to some people's definition of a 'war game' here, I would suggest The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion... It won a couple of (RPG) awards.
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Michael Ward
United States
Laurel Springs
NJ
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The Operational Art of War can be found here:
http://www.matrixgames.com/games/screens.asp?gid=317
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Nathan Bryan
United States
Pittsburgh
Pennsylvania
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It's not realistic war game, but Disciples 2 is a great turn based war game. Combat is played out in rounds just like moving pieces feels very much like you are playing a board game in a lot of ways. Also you build up cities to create new types of units.
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Scott Alden
United States
Dallas
Texas
Aldie's Full of Love!
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Korsun Pocket
Airborne Assault
Allied General
Combat Mission (1st 3 versions - not the latest abomination)
Steel Panthers
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Brad Miller
United States
Seattle
Washington
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Aldie, I've been out of the CM loop for a while.
what is "the latest abomination"?
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Scott Alden
United States
Dallas
Texas
Aldie's Full of Love!
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Windopaene wrote: Aldie, I've been out of the CM loop for a while.
what is "the latest abomination"?
Combat Mission Shock Force
http://www.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/combatmissionshockforce/...
I played the demo - and it was just embarrassing for them - not sure what's going on over there.
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Brad Miller
United States
Seattle
Washington
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Thanks Aldie. Sounds ugly...
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Carl Deaton
United States
Springfield
Oregon
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My preference:
Steel Panthers: World at War (and it's free!)
Operational Art of War: Century of Warfare (lots of scenarios)
Battleground Series of the American Civil War from Talonsoft (HPS has put out new Tiller Civil War titles which might trump these now, but I still play the old ones.)
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Rik Van Horn
United States
Livonia
New York
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If you want world domination, this is your baby:
http://www.gamersgate.com/index.php?page=shop.product_detail...
Hearts of Iron: Doomsday In this one you'll control units all over the entire world. It's intense, but you get to feel like a world conqueror.
If you want turn based up close and personal tactics:
http://www.jaggedalliance2.com/
Jagged Alliance 2 This is probably my favorite turn based game. Play with tons of guns and you'll get a weapons lesson no other game can give you.
You'll have a leader and squad based missions. You can perform night ops, day ops, whatever suits the individual talents of your squad. have a few hold down the fort and send out your stealthiest guy to clear the way.
Or send in the whole squad, guns blazing and blow anything in your path to kingdom come.
There's no other game like it really.
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Scott Alden
United States
Dallas
Texas
Aldie's Full of Love!
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Jagged Alliance 2 is awesome.
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Jorge Montero
United States
St Louis
Missouri
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Tide Of Iron is great at the grand strategy level. The sequel got better in some ways, but also worse in others IMO.
I've always been fond of the rather ancient Clash of Steel, which runs at a slightly more manageable scale.
Sid Meier's Gettysburg is fun, if a little light. The Napoleonic version of the game never worked quite as well for me though. For that period I'd rather play the much heavier Battleground 8: Ligny and Quatre Bras. AH, the fun of playing Nappy at Ligny when the reserve comes in from Wagnele.
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Josh Luub
United States
San Jose
California
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Panzer General (I tried the PG3:Scorched Earth demo): Not bad, but again (like Korsun Pocket) it looks like they gave in to the urge to give each unit seventy-three attributes, because they could. Also, why the heck does it have to be in 3d??
Steel Panthers/Allied General/etc: Ok, these may very well be good games, but let's try to focus on stuff published in the last 10 years, ok? (On the other hand, I did spend part of today playing the old 1830 PC game. Man, that thing rocks).
HEARTS of Iron 2 (not TIDE, I wonder what game you've been playing?!): Downloading the demo now. This looks cool, even though it's not exactly what I was asking for. I played the old Europa Universalis 2 a long while back, and had a lot of fun with that. I'm a bit concerned, though, because I downloaded a demo of Europa Universalis 3 recently, and it wouldn't run on my computer, my graphics card isn't up to date enough! For a boardgame! (Ok, so between some games being too old, and some too new, maybe I'm being a bit too picky).
Op Art of War 3: This looks interesting. I wish there was a demo!
Still looking through some of the other suggestions... Thanks all!
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Alex Henderson
Cayman Islands
Grand Cayman
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1830 -
Couldn't agree more. Probably the best game of the DOS era.
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Charlie Sheppard
United States
Seattle
Washington
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I haven't played them yet but I hear great things about Birth of America and the other games from Ageod (I'm waiting for their upcoming Napoleonic era title). I'm also looking forward to trying Disciples III when I find the time. The games I've actually played and enjoyed include the Combat Mission series, Conquest of the Aegean (latest Airborne Assault title), Space Empires IV, and Galactic Civilizations II. For a quick fix check out http://awbw.amarriner.com/ (Advanced Tactics online).
I really wanted to enjoy Uncommon Valor, being a Pacific Theater buff, but it was just too complex and too long (and I play OCS!)
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Mark Hubbard
United States
California
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Quote: Ok, these may very well be good games, but let's try to focus on stuff published in the last 10 years, ok? ...For hex&counter games I would have suggested Civil War Generals I & II, but, seeing as you're gonna be PICKY about how OLD they are, and all...
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I have to support Combat Mission 1,2 and 3. To me this was really Squad Leader with a view from inside the action. Very tense against a human opponent!
You could try "Strategic Command: European Theatre" as well. The link points to the new version which I haven't played yet but the original was and is very good!
Currently I'm playing "Commander: Europe At War" which can be considered a mix between Hitler's War and Panzer General (PC) but perhaps even more like a better looking version of the above. As I do have some technical issues and only just received the game it's hard to compare them both.
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Check the HPS titles. They offer hex and counter PC wargames for different periods and conflicts: American Revolution, Civil War, Napoleonics, WWII, Modern, Ancients, e.t.c.
http://www.hpssims.com/index.htm
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