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Todd
United States
Warren
Michigan
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I'm new to boards games (in to it for a year now) and decided to try Eldersign, some of the components were printed with the wrong info on them, character cards that are used to play every turn and the instructions are very hard to understand (I had to watch the videos and ask questions here to learn the game) others here on BGG told me the instructions are a nightmare and find another way to learn.
I've been told that FFG may not fix the mistakes and if they do they will not send them to the folks who already own the game.
Is this true?
I can't believe they would not send out replacement components.
Plaid Hat games fixed one of their cards and offered it to people free of charge and that is one of the smallest publishers out there (for now)
I hope they do a better job of taking care of us than that.
And what about the copies that are out there now, will everyone want to buy the game with the incorrect character cards.
I often forget rules that are printed correctly when I bring a game back out from not beign played much, let alone trying to remember which game peices (character cards) are printed wrong
For long time gamers this may not be a problem, but a game like this I think is designed more for newer less experienced gamers who may not remember corrections that have to be looked up in a pdf file every time you pull the game out, just seems like it could affect some people more than others, myself included
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Maurice Tousignant
Canada
Windsor
Ontario
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I've never seen them send out replacements. They will often offer up PDFs of any updated cards that you can print yourself (or get printed). Often if there is a later expansion for a game they will include updated cards for the original in the expansion (I've actually got about 6 games where they have done this).
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Joel Tamburo
United States
Unspecified
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Actually they are printing up replacement components for Mansions of Madness. So it is possible that others will follow.
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Justin Hoeger
United States
Oceano
California
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They also sometimes include replacement components in expansions, like Shattered Empire for Twilight Imperium. Occasionally they will update a mistake in a later printing of a game; you might try asking customer service for a replacement if you know this to be the case (it wouldn't be with Elder Sign yet). But in general with FFG titles (and most other games I know of), you'll want to refer to an official FAQ to correct printing or rules errors.
Producing components with corrected typos and non-catastrophic mistakes for a product with thousands of copies is not very economical, so you're more likely to see a FAQ with errata you can refer to than you are reprinted components. Printing corrected components is expensive and potentially wasteful if they're not claimed by the people whose copies are affected — they have to be printed in large numbers to be cost-effective, which I'm sure is why FFG and other companies don't offer corrected replacements in general. Mansions of Madness struck me as a special case, with errors that really couldn't be corrected by an errata entry or two.
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United States
Pennsylvania
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I guess it depends on what you ask for since I've gotten replacement dice and books for Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay.
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Patiently waiting for the zombie apocalypse...
United States
Colorado Springs
Colorado
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My understanding with the disastrous printing of Mansions of Madness: Forbidden Alchemy they will be sending out replacement components to those who unfortunately have the first print run.
I hope this is the case, because I have a copy of that print run, and the messed up components are a disappointment.
As my personal experience, I've always had terrific customer service with FFG. I had some horribly splitting counters for TI3 when I bought my copy and they sent me all new replacements.
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As far as board games, yes, at least in the past they've been really good about correcting (minor) mistakes in games for me. Not sure about large mistakes.
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Sean P
United States
Tucson
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From having played the game about a dozen times and reading the FAQ, there isn't that much for them to replace. 3 investigator cards were slightly changed. The rest is rulebook clarifications and a few rules changes that take about a minute to figure out. I doubt they'll reprint just those and the rule book and send them to everyone that bought the game and I don't think they need to.
http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/Elder%20Sign/s...
As far as standing behind their product, I've had 2 instances I contacted them about over the last 5 years or so. A wrinkled board for Arkham Horror and a couple missing dwarf figures from War of the Ring. Got them both sent to me in a couple of weeks. I think it's a great little company that's getting bigger. Although around here they get smacked like a pinata.
FFG makes complicated games with lots of text and icons. The publisher explained that each card sometimes has dozens of different versions and every now and then the wrong one slips in to be sent to the printer.
I guess my real answer is buy they game if you want. It's playable out of the box. If you can't understand the rules, read the FAQ and some of the cheat sheets on the geek. If you still don't get something post a question or message me and I'll get back to you.
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Mr Derrp!
United States
Crystal
Minnesota
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Kaleljorson7 wrote: The publisher explained that each card sometimes has dozens of different versions and every now and then the wrong one slips in to be sent to the printer.
This is true no doubt.
Having said that, you think they'd create some sort of version control system to make sure this doesn't happen. A little setup on the front end to reduce all the headaches on the back end. Catch that small error now, or better yet, prevent them from happening, saves FAQ and errata and re-prints. If I worked there, I'd be proactively creating a process to solve this problem.
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Todd
United States
Warren
Michigan
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derp wrote: Kaleljorson7 wrote: The publisher explained that each card sometimes has dozens of different versions and every now and then the wrong one slips in to be sent to the printer. This is true no doubt. Having said that, you think they'd create some sort of version control system to make sure this doesn't happen. A little setup on the front end to reduce all the headaches on the back end. Catch that small error now, or better yet, prevent them from happening, saves FAQ and errata and re-prints. If I worked there, I'd be proactively creating a process to solve this problem.
Yes I agree.
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Todd
United States
Warren
Michigan
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You should always fix mistakes, don't allow your customers feel that they can't trust your new products and should wait to see if there is anyting wrong and the mistakes to be fixed before they buy your new whatch ma bob.
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Gunther Schmidl
Austria
Linz
OÖ
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I asked for, and received, replacements for several components, including the misprinted sheet for Chaos in the Old World.
Also, expansions will often contain corrected cards.
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Will Todd
United States
Twin Falls
Idaho
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bmwrider wrote: You should always fix mistakes, don't allow your customers feel that they can't trust your new products and should wait to see if there is anyting wrong and the mistakes to be fixed before they buy your new whatch ma bob.
Have you actually contacted FFG about your concerns with your copy of Elder Sign?
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Daniel Running
United States
Washington
Dist of Columbia
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I've always found FFG to be responsive and quick. I needed a whole punchboard for Runewars and I got it sent to me in less than a week. They make, easily, all my favorite games and I am ever bewildered when folks knock the company around. Who else is making such cool-ass games?
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David Sterling
United States
Redmond
Washington
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The Mansions of Madness and Elder Sign issues have pushed me over the edge with FFG games. I'll likely be buying very little of their games in the future. While they do make some fun ones, I hate the thought of their initial customers being their playtesters and having to buy later prints to get the components/rulebooks that actually work.
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Received Dust Tactics fig that was literally eaten by my dog (not eevn FFG's fault), Battles of Napoleon corrected cards, and a now, new Operation Cerberus scenario book that was not colated correctly.
The card errors addressed in FAQs have been more rewordings than major revisions.(Warhammer: Invasion) I've had no issues at all with FFG and their policies.
A civil e-mail that defines the problem will get a response. Please and Thank You always helps.
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Colorcrayons
United States
Maplewood
Minnesota
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TheToaster wrote: Hectarion wrote: The Mansions of Madness and Elder Sign issues have pushed me over the edge with FFG games. I'll likely be buying very little of their games in the future. While they do make some fun ones, I hate the thought of their initial customers being their playtesters and having to buy later prints to get the components/rulebooks that actually work.
Your loss, not there's  .
Were you born under a rock?
Of course its FFG's loss. Its loss of revenue when precedence like the one they have set comes to the minds and wallets of consumers.
Hectarion basically fired FFG. How is that not FFG's loss?
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Colorcrayons
United States
Maplewood
Minnesota
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Yep. He is one person. Is it possible that perhaps he might not be the only one? I know he is not the only one here on BGG who had made such statements.
Extremely small minority on BGG? Perhaps. Though neither of us has the info to debate that with any sort of real accuracy so that statement is merely an assumption and nothing more.
There will always be people who do nothing but whine about everything just as there will always be people who will blindly defend something no matter what. The real problem lies in between.
Bottomline is when customers say that they have had enough of the bullshit, it is time for the company to take notice, no matter how seemingly insignificant YOU seem to think the complaints are.
Negative word of mouth is absolutely bad for any business. And lately FFG have earned a bit of genuine rancor from customers in a few areas which they recognize and are trying to eliminate. What areas those may be are subjective, some seeing more feedback than others.
So you can maintain that he is the only one losing out by not purchasing FFG games. But in reality it is one less customer that FFG can rely on to be a successful company.
[edit] I have no personal bone to pick in this. I only stuck my nose in and remarked because a poster came here sharing their experience and the effect that experience has had, only to be replied to with a belittling remark about how insignificant their post was. Just to be clear.[/edit]
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Colorcrayons
United States
Maplewood
Minnesota
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TheToaster wrote: They will be looking at their mistakes and problems but not worrying
No kidding? Because there was a pretty big to-do about the recent Mansions of Madness fiasco at FFG HQ.
As in a major meeting. Not just a small gathering and a small discussion. But taking a large step backwards and some introspection about QC and how the company as a whole can change that.
I guess if your comments are anything to go by, FFG has nothing to worry about and should just keep on allowing questionable QC to take place.
Luckily for their consumer base, they are doing the exact opposite and taking to heart complaints made and trying to become an actual leader in the industry instead of a warning to other game companies about what not to do.
Mistakes will always be made and occur. it is unavoidable. But FFG are being proactive about them instead of ignoring them.
Complaints help everyone. They help the company to improve its QC. It helps ALL consumers by providing a superior product.
And yet, there always has to be handful of people belittling those complaints as if those complaints were directed squarely at them.
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Scott Milbuta
United States
Winter Springs
Florida
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If any one does not like the FFG game they purchased please send the game to me for playtesting to identify all of the horrible things poor FFG QA..missed.
ill even send ya a report back so you can email them.
Ps. I keep the game as compensation for my trouble shooting...deal?
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David Sterling
United States
Redmond
Washington
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I totally did not follow up on this thread...
I personally do not take offence at your post, I'm merely saying that FFG has wronged me as the customer multiple times. I don't care for their games anymore. It's really not MY loss as I'm the one who keeps my $35 for a terrible game that I do not really want to play. It's as easy as that.
Pre-2011, FFG was a great company. They've gone significantly downhill since then. Their QC has gone out the window and they now release games after what seems like a few rounds.
There are plenty of other great game companies out there. I'll give them my money now rather than FFG.
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Posted Tue Jan 31, 2012 12:13 am
